I’m a worship leader at a non denomination church with… shall we say… charismatic leanings. We’re not weird. Nor “holy rollers.”
But we do believe in living a Spirit filled, Spirit led life by prayer and the Word. We ascribe to the things Paul writes about in 1 Corinthians 12, 13 and 14.
In the past, we’ve encouraged people to worship the Lord in Spirit and in Truth, urging them to express their hearts to the Lord as we sing.
Dancing and flag waving has become a part of that expression for some. And distraction to others. Some want the leadership to let the people worship freely. Dance is found as a form of worship in the Bible.
Other in the congregation want it restricted. They feel they cannot invite outsiders because the guest won’t understand the flag waving and dancing. It’s too unusual. Different.
We’ve noticed guests arriving and leaving early. If they stay, many don’t return.
So the leadership has been debating this topic for months now, even talking with the pastor of another church who has a large dance ministry. He has the same struggle.
Now I grew up with this stuff. The pastor’s wife at our church in Tallahassee was a dance major at Florida State. She was a beautiful dancer and trained those in the congregation how to dance before the Lord. There was structure and order to the dancing.
Flag waving? Not a big deal. We do it a ball games, right? Scripture is full of the singers going out behind the banners. AKA, flags.
When the Lord sent me to Israel in ’93, I was on a dance and intercession team. And I’m not a dancer…
Yet I can see how it’s a distraction. Our sanctuary is boxy, and not built for a lot of movement.
Maybe to the outside eye, flag waving and dancing seems like an awkward expression. In my church now, we don’t have a dance ministry leader, so there’s less organization and structure.
All in all, those who express themselves in dance and flag waving do it well.
Recently the leadership talked to the dancers and flag wavers about moving to the back of the sanctuary during worship.
Being in the back means more people feel liberty to move about… And some are not always aware of their movements.
Sunday we had a couple of visitors. Like most first timers, they sat in the back. When worship started, the flags started. In the back.
And somewhere along the line, those visitors got “wooshed” with a flag. Not once, but twice. It’s unclear if they were hit with the flag stick, or if just the flag itself wafted over their heads, but either way, they were gone. Skedaddle. Out of there.
One of the pastors tried to catch them, but they were too quick. The whole incident seems to have been a combination of things.
The flag waver not being aware. The observers not moving quick enough to remind the flag waver to pay attention.
The guest probably felt uncomfortable and not bold enough to tell the flag waver to be careful. I mean, would you? If you were in a new church?
I’ve been in some kind of ministry for 22 years. Before that, I watched ministry from my parents point-of-view.
It is never, ever easy to be in ministry. Some people want more liberty and more room for the Holy Spirit to move. Others want more structure, more organization.
I’ve heard debates over polar opposite issues like pre trib and post. Healing is deliverance from sickness to going home to heaven being the ultimate healing. Do we have to tithe ten percent? Wasn’t that the Old Testament?
Leading a church is not easy. I don’t envy our pastors. Because every one in the congregation comes to the house with their own paradigm, their own experience, and even yes, their own fears and wounds.
Pray for your pastors. Ask the Holy Spirit to teach and enlighten them. Don’t pray what you want, or what some other guy wants, pray what Jesus wants. He is the perfect leader.
To the couple who got “wooshed,” I pray you find the right church home where you can grow in the love and knowledge of God. Grace and peace. I’m sorry you got “wooshed” today but we are imperfect and still working it out.
What about you? Are their church traditions or expression that you like? That make you uncomfortable? Is it valid? Is it culture?
Comments 23
I grew up in a church firmly steeped in legalism, but I have fond memories because that’s where my seeds were planted.
I’m in children’s ministry because I remember the love my grandma showered on her Sunday school kids. She taught Sunday school until the day she died–a Tuesday with preparations for her lesson spread out on her dining room table.
I serve on my church’s board as Christian Education Supervisor. Helping to make decisions to benefit the church body aren’t always easy and come with some resistance, but I’m thankful for our pastor who is a solid man of God. Praying for him is an honor.
Great post, Rachel. Your ministry blesses so many people.
Thanks, Lisa. We do need to pray for our church leaders. We criticize too much.
Hugs, Rachel
Good article. My wife and I have also been involved on staff in churches, also doing pastoral work for many years throughout our marriage. So I can appreciate everything you said about church life.
My wife and I are for the first time in 27 years finding ourselves in a search for a new church home. Prior to this, we have always been rooted long term in a body. We are also people who embrace “the gifts” as you mentioned and so that has always been just a part of the background.
This past Sunday, we tried out a church we’d heard about. We got there a bit late as my GPS took us the most ridiculous route it could have. So walking into the building we could hear the worship music already playing and as I opened the door to the sanctuary, saw flags “wooshing” everywhere. I have seen this a time or two before but it was much more subdued, I assumed for obvious reasons: To not distract people from worshipping God. Well, here, it almost seemed that the flags and their wavers were going out of their way to bring as much attention to the flags as possible. And I had to hand it to them, people’s heads (including mine) were following them as they moved and danced across the front area of the sanctuary and repeatedly down each aisle. I tried closing my eyes and just focusing on the music but would be startled by this flag runner flying by me “wooshing” me repeatedly with his flags – as we had mistakenly sat on an aisle row which was a flag runner main drag. They would even dip and woosh the flags over the people sitting in every part of the fairly small sanctuary. “Everyone gets a woosh” I guess at this church. The more I describe, the more critical I feel I sound – but I’m really just reporting our experience. It just seemed this was a part of this ministry that had gone rogue and needs to be addressed. If it weren’t for that, the worship seemed earnest, and sincere – I just really felt robbed of being able to enter in. I suppose some will say it’s I who have the problem. Nonetheless, we’re probably going to keep looking.
Author
Steve, Thanks for stopping by. I hear you, flags, dancers, artist on stage can be distracting. I think it’s up to the worship leader or pastor to keep those in movement ministry aligned with humility.
I was on a prophetic dance team in Israel once. I learned a lot about movement in worship. Didn’t realize some people see words, see the Lord in movement. Years later a woman in our church came up to me after a woman danced (back when we had dancers) and said she had a prophetic word to interpret the movements. She was as shocked as any one by this. “What is that?”
So I think all aspects of worship are allowed. But all have to be in order too, you know? Pray for those in movement ministry in your church. 🙂
Blessings,
Rachel
OMG ! I am so sick of the flag waving at my church ! I find it so very distracting ! After over 10 years at the same church I’m praying that God gives me peace ! In addition to the flag waving is now special lighting that swirl around, fog / haze, and a increase in loudness of everything during Praise and Worship. When did any of this become needful to have an atmosphere for God and the Holy Spirit to move ? Every song, 4-5, there is this person waving 2 Big Flags. I try to stay put so to be by my family but have been having to step out until Praise and Worship is over. That does not seem right. I have often been the one shouting or running or loudly crying but only when the Holy Spirit really moved me to do so. It does not seem to be Bible based way if you go in planing on running, jumping, or waving flags. Like back when there always way that somebody that always banged on a tambourine during every song to the point that it became distracting. Please pray for me (anyone that reads this) cause I do not want to stop going to the church where I feel God would have me to be. My family and I are very involved. There have been to many changes I our lives so not wanting to start asking God to place me somewhere else. Husband and family man, Martin H. ( and minister )
Author
Hey Chris, I hear you. I’m not sure I understand all the flash used in today’s worship but flag waving goes back to the OT. Those “banners” we read about. They are actually weapons of warfare! I’ve come to understand we’re all unique before God and worship Him in our way but in a corporate setting we have to make room for all expressions as long as they are in order and really worship.
If you can, keep your eyes closed. 🙂 Ask the Lord to show you what He sees when they are worshipping with flags. As a worship leader I occasionally admonish the people to NOT bring judgment into the room by judging someone who worships differently than they do, or would feel comfortable doing. If you have to face the back and just let the lyrics and music carry you.
I appreciate your heart here! Really wanting to honor the service and your family! Saying a prayer for you! RH
Dear Chris,
I thank you for sharing your views.
I came across flags and was opened minded about it.
We at church were told that flagging is an extension of our arms and that there are various reasons as to why flags are used,
ok..with that said (fast forwarding the story) I had a lot of thoughts about this but I could only really understand until I give it a go and you know try it for myself.
I spoke to God and asked for a deeper understanding. Not wanting to do in vain but to get a genuine understanding. I picked up a flag during worship and with an open heart gave it a go. Not really knowing what I was doing, started to wave. When I say it changed my perception. Just as you would wave your hands in praise, I waved the flag and it was the most powerful experience I had experienced at that moment. Nothing else in the room mattered! The words of the song that was being sung I used my arms to wave and express my love for our Lord. An extremely intimate moment I will never forget.
Since that experience about a year ago, I kept being drawn to use flags to express myself. I believe it may not be for everyone, but everyone should give it a go. With an open mind God will speak back to you. I’ve been so drawn into flagging I now have my own set of flags and use not only in church but also at home. Not all the time we only can communicate with God through words. Another way to communicate and express is use of flags. I hope this helps and I hope you give it a go one day.
My husband caught me flagging in the garden and came to join me. He gave it a go and started to dance while flagging oh what a moment that was for me! Men can flag to and all in all you give yourself to God for Him to use you to be able to minister unto others.
Author
I love this story, Tamara!
Hi
Flags has spiritual meaning too.
David was dancing for God his was
was not happy. I do not agree that
they hit people with flags but my
thought will be, this is worship to God
not to me.
We are all there to worship God with songs
Clapping of hands,with flags with
dancing, hey if that pleases God so
be it.
We should be mindful of people
moving around not hit them with
flags. I join a church because
they worshiped in dance and flags.
I felt they were very serious about
giving God the highest praise.
I felt they took worship to another
level.
People are looking for entertainment
that is not what they should be
there for.
Author
Good point!
Rachel, I’m not sure why when I press reply nothing was happening, so hopefully this will link up with my first entry back in Feb 2018.
I wanted to give you an update on what has happened since my writing to you:
The following Sunday we walked in to another church about a mile away from the previous one. I could not really see what was going on up front yet but I just remember being gripped by the presence of God immediately upon entering the sanctuary doors. As my wife and our 19-year-old son caught up with me we began to walk forward to find seats as close up as we could. I’d say it must be about a five or 600 seats sanctuary, and as we were walking up I saw a FLAG – actually 2 being waved by an Asian lady with long hair. Actually it was two smaller flags, and she had her eyes closed and moved as though she had professional training. Not that that should matter, but as I noticed that I was easily able to focus on the words on the screen and enter in to worship. And I thought to myself, this must be what “decently and in order” is in this context. At first, my first thoughts were “here we go again“ but then I experienced something a very different. Although I was mainly focusing on the screen, I couldn’t help but notice that her movements/dancing and everything was being done in a very non-sensual manner – as unto the Lord and not to bring glory or attention per se to herself. That was remarkably apparent in spite of her very high skill level. And God really anointed it. I had never seen anything like this before and amazingly un-distracting – if that’s a word. And it’s not every service or on every song. The flags & dance there is more like a seasoning I’d say and so, there ya go. 😁
So ….😁 I don’t know if God is having a bit of fun with me or what but from our first time walking into that sanctuary the presence of God gripped us and we have been there ever since. Absolutely love the praise and worship “( flags & all – which are pretty minimal) and the church itself is really one that is focused on reaching out to the entire city and bringing in the lost. So I thought you might enjoy hearing follow up story about this. God bless!
Author
Yay God! That’s what it’s all about. So good to hear this update! Thanks for letting me know. I do think movement worship with dance and flags is something we don’t quite know how to pastor in the church. It even has me thinking about our flag wavers. But it is something that should fall under the worship leader/pastor’s instruction and leadership. 🙂
When someone is skilled and anointed, totally focused on God while dancing or waving a flag, it is so powerful.
Another story on my end… one of our more conservative women felt the Lord nudging her to worship with a flag. She fought it but finally yielded and went to the back with a flag. I was up front on keyboard and the moment I looked out and saw her waving that flag in worship, I came undone. It was like warfare. She was a lioness in the spirit. Crazy. Her movements were nominal and simple but something in the heavens changed when she took up her banner!
Blessings! Rachel
Author
Steve, I’m late to reply I think but I do love the update to your flag testimony! Isn’t God amazing… so kind and patient with us, even has a bit of fun with us! 🙂 I think we’ll be overwhelmed by the banners and flags we’ll see in heaven!
It is interesting to see the comments. When we lived up north before moving to Florida I had a flag ministry. It started with the children and eventually some of the adults joined in. I did have some instruction before church service began so that things were done in order. We had an auditorium which was large enough for the flag wavers to be way off to the side so as not to distract from “up front” in any way and they were able to dance and be free to do warfare or just enjoy the Lord’s presence. No one ever got “wooshed”. I have been in churches and meetings where the flag waving seemed to be a fad that everyone wanted to get in on. Everything should be done as unto the Lord but you know that doesn’t always happen. We have to have grace for those who are not there yet. Just recently we attended a retreat center where the flag waving was up front and most distracting. And I have to say I love the flag worship. There was so much distraction over which flag to grab for each song and which prop to use that I had to close my eyes for most of the worship time. These flag worshippers are at this place often so it was not an isolated incident. On the other hand I have been at other places with beautiful flag worship that absolutely enhanced the worship experience. A well trained dance team is also a wonderful addition to the worship experience when ministering under the anointing. Church leaders definitely need our prayers!
Thank you for the history of the flag waving in church. I love it It helps to worship more freely.
If it pleases God. Then let it be allowed. We praise God with uplifted hands instruments singing vocal praises and dancing. I onced danced in the Holy Spirit when He fell on me. It is amazing 👍🙏
I was not allowed to dance as a child growing up, at school or church functions. Yet, when my family was out at various activities, I would push furniture aside, turn on worship music and dance before the Lord. While helping in children’s ministry, I realized that it was okay to sing music with various and expressions or movement, yet it wasn’t okay in the big adult church. I was therefore frustrated having to not move except clapping. The Lord continually dealt with me as to whether I would be obedient to His leading or the traditions and fears of men. I had been in Christmas and Easter programs all my life. I was left in charge of a youth play with music. The pastor and choir director were okay with adding dance to the songs. The elders were not. I was told off by people, saying, “You will not dance in my church.” The choir director sent me to a worship symposium where I soon discovered over 2000 people, hungry to worship the Lord with all their heart, body and mind. During one session in a large the teacher put on music and asked us to begin to move as the Holy Spirit led us during a song. People were hesitant, due to tradition as I was. But slowly but surely we all began to move, to worship, to dance, to weep. The class ended and we seemed to be unable to move. Other people tried to enter and it was as if there was a wall keeping them out. Eventually we were able to stand. But I would never be the same.
For someone to tell people that they cannot dance, is like telling a worship leader that they can’t sing, or a pastor that he no longer can preach, or a guitarist that he can no longer play. God gave us the desire to worship Him with everything that is within us. I have led drama, dance, flag, streamers, tambourine teams for over 40 years. I am 74 years old. The flags and streamers provide an outlet of worship for those that are skilled dancers as well as those that feel awkward. You can still feel graceful.
It is important for pastors and leaders to explain the Biblical perspective of the use of these weapons of worship, warfare and intercession. Proper attire is vital. The colors are important. God’s Word is full of the use and meaning of colors. Above all, the heart of the dancer is the most important. This is not just for women. Men that humble themselves and dance before the Lord or warfare with the flags, can break strongholds. They can be powerful. The dance team should be an extension of the worship team and be able to flow with them, being in tune with what the Holy Spirit has led them to accomplish. Is it warfare over a situation that needs to be broken, or is it to usher in a feeling of peace from heartaches the church may be suffering? Maybe the Lord is leading them to lift the spirit of the congregation and help them be willing and determined to make breakthrough in whatever is happening. It’s not about just singing a few songs. It’s not about performance. It’s about loving our Lord with everything within us.
Author
Oh Deborah, I love your testimony!
We’re Pentecostal and flags have been common at our church for years. My 11 year old son doesn’t go to the kids ministry nor has he ever, his choice not mine. He has a heart for God and love’s worship. He’s always waved a flag when he felt led, but today he was told that his flag waiving is disruptive to the worship team and blocks the worship team from our live stream service. I was told this has been a rule for years, yet I’ve seen it so many times…kids and adults. We have multiple cameras and could just switch angles. And for me my heart says that seeing the spirit move is more touching than seeing the stage…reminds me of the song I don’t need my name in lights, I’m famous in my Fathers eyes. His heart broke. My heart broke for him, apparently the worship team needs face time more than hosting the Holy Spirit. It comes across as here’s your box, worship in that. Some may say it’s distracting, but same could be said for any of the other Pentecostal expressions of worship. It all felt very corporate to me and I question if the Pentecostal aspects and foundations are being lost to look more mainstream.
Author
When we went to live streaming during COVID we learned a lot about the nuances of being live as opposed to being online. There are adjustments to be made. We now have to consider, a least in part, the online viewer. But how amazing so many churches are now online!
I’m sorry your son was shut down, however. Can he worship with the flags in the back? If not, encourage him at home! 🙂
Blessings!
Hey everybody, I just moved to Tampa, Florida and in my quest to find a church that is open to flagging during worshipping I found your article Rachel. Thank you for opening this discussion through comments.
Do you have any advice on how to find a church or even a worshipping symposium like Deborah mentioned?
Thank you in advance and God bless.
Author
Hey Danielle, I don’t know of any place… sorry.
Amen, great article. Ive been to “Church” my whole life and have recently been born again and received Christ. At 43 years old unlearning what the world taught us about “church” has been very difficult, but I know the Lord is raising an army within my spirit to share his Good News. I found this article seeking to learn more about flag waiving as I am constantly challenging myself to explore and familiarize myself with what I know to be uncomfortable in my flesh. I pray the world comes to know the fullness of Jesus and let themselves go
Author
Shane, blessings to you! The Holy Spirit is the perfect teacher!